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 PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2011 11:36 am 

Thunderbird
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+Lakini+ wrote:
Thunderbird wrote:
+Lakini+ wrote:
Look, I don't mean to start anything, but really, Nicki? Rolling Eyes


I have some bad experience with gays. Sorry.


Yes, I understand, but you shouldn't generalize. There are jerks in every sort of sexual, racial, religious or whatever else group, it doesn't mean the entire group is like that. Statistically speaking there are most likely more straight jerks than gay jerks.


Sure, maybe there are some guys - gays I mean - that are OK, but is it really worth searching for them... I mean, sure not all people are the same, but some groups of people are showing significant similarities.

 
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 PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2011 11:47 am 

+Lakini+
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I honestly don't see a causal link between someone's sexual orientation and them being jerks. I understand you've had some bad experiences with gay guys, but you haven't met all gay guys.

Saying 'I know X, Y and Z, they are jerks and they happen to be gay, ergo a lot of gays are probably also jerks' is in no way different than saying 'I know X. Y and Z, they are jerks and they happen to play tennis, ergo a lot of tennis players are probably also jerks.' It's not logical, because it takes exactly one nice tennis player to invalidate your assumption.

 
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 PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2011 12:00 pm 

Thunderbird
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+Lakini+ wrote:
It's not logical, because it takes exactly one nice tennis player to invalidate your assumption.


I actually know one nice tennis player Smile Am I wrong Sasha Smile

However, Laura, you are right. But when you already met X, Y and Z and they ara gay and jerks, I really doubt to have the power to search for a hypothetical specimen, that is not like them. You see, I have the negaive experience, why on earth would I go for a fourth one, when all of them until now were jerks?! No, I won't bother.
When you are a member of some social group (like gays) you are an ambassador of this group towards the rest of the world. Just like you - you a kind of an ambassador of Romania in Finland. You are the one, that shows other people who and what romanians are. So if you were a jerk, do you believe that the suomi guys will have a good opinion for Romania? Don't think so.

 
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 PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2011 12:27 pm 

+Lakini+
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Thunderbird wrote:
+Lakini+ wrote:
It's not logical, because it takes exactly one nice tennis player to invalidate your assumption.


I actually know one nice tennis player Smile Am I wrong Sasha Smile

However, Laura, you are right. But when you already met X, Y and Z and they ara gay and jerks, I really doubt to have the power to search for a hypothetical specimen, that is not like them. You see, I have the negaive experience, why on earth would I go for a fourth one, when all of them until now were jerks?! No, I won't bother.
When you are a member of some social group (like gays) you are an ambassador of this group towards the rest of the world. Just like you - you a kind of an ambassador of Romania in Finland. You are the one, that shows other people who and what romanians are. So if you were a jerk, do you believe that the suomi guys will have a good opinion for Romania? Don't think so.


I think the fault in this case lies both with the ambassador and the people meeting them. The ambassador should be aware of what they are representing and act accordingly. But at the same time, people meeting them should keep an open mind and be aware that this is ONE individual (or three, or a limited number of a large group) and therefore he/she does not project all the group's attributes 100% accurately. Yes, it's possible to say that all active athletes are fit based on meeting one athlete, because there's a number of other supporting arguments that make this true aside from you meeting a fit athlete. If you meet 100 blond nordics, there's a genetic likelihood that most nordics are blond, but you can't say that for sure until you've observed all nordics and determined this statistically (many Finns are dark-haired, incidentally Laughing)

All these things are to say that what I'm speaking against here is generalization, which is just one step away from stereotype. Because I've lived with a very upsetting stereotype since I moved to Finland: Romanians are poor and uneducated, and come to Finland to beg and steal. If someone said that to you, even though you are obviously a nicely dressed successful MA student, it would hurt you that they automatically jump to the wrong conclusion without giving you a chance.

So yes, I think it's worth looking for that one positive experience that would validate the stereotype. Or if you don't want to actively look for it, you should at least keep your mind open.

 
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 PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2011 8:58 pm 

lynx
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Ahahahahahahah, oh, shut up, i didn't know i was "ambassador" for being a woman, for straights, with a bit of bi inclination, for a blondes... for whatever else Very Happy

I do pity your knowledge of the world. Laughing

Funny thing, you pick randomly some qualities for example from three gays you know, then you meet a fourth guy or see a picture of him in a forum... hmm, he has that same quality like the three gay guys, that has absolutely nothing to do with sexual orientation... but, hey, i have an idea! Probably that guy's also gay, because he has that quality! (Say, red hair for example, ahahahha). And wait for it, therefore he's obnoxious also!
Red hair -> Gay -> Mean personality, runs when you most need them...
Vah, what a logic Smile

 
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 PostPosted: Fri Oct 07, 2011 8:51 am 

Thunderbird
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lynx wrote:
Ahahahahahahah, oh, shut up, i didn't know i was "ambassador" for being a woman, for straights, with a bit of bi inclination, for a blondes... for whatever else Very Happy

I do pity your knowledge of the world. Laughing

Funny thing, you pick randomly some qualities for example from three gays you know, then you meet a fourth guy or see a picture of him in a forum... hmm, he has that same quality like the three gay guys, that has absolutely nothing to do with sexual orientation... but, hey, i have an idea! Probably that guy's also gay, because he has that quality! (Say, red hair for example, ahahahha). And wait for it, therefore he's obnoxious also!
Red hair -> Gay -> Mean personality, runs when you most need them...
Vah, what a logic Smile


If you burned your fingers three times, when touching the oven, would you go for a fourth?

 
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 PostPosted: Fri Oct 07, 2011 8:56 am 

Heropsychosacha
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+Lakini+ wrote:
'I know X. Y and Z, they are jerks and they happen to play tennis, ergo a lot of tennis players are probably also jerks.' It's not logical, because it takes exactly one nice tennis player to invalidate your assumption.


So now all tennis players are jerks? Razz

No, seriously, this must be the most stupid discussion we've ever had on WFT. I don't feel any need to contribute.

 
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 PostPosted: Fri Oct 07, 2011 1:51 pm 

+Lakini+
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Heropsychosacha wrote:
+Lakini+ wrote:
'I know X. Y and Z, they are jerks and they happen to play tennis, ergo a lot of tennis players are probably also jerks.' It's not logical, because it takes exactly one nice tennis player to invalidate your assumption.


So now all tennis players are jerks? Razz

No, seriously, this must be the most stupid discussion we've ever had on WFT. I don't feel any need to contribute.


Sacha, have you read the entire post?

And just for the record, I didn't pick tennis players as an example on purpose. It was the first thing that came to mind, I'm not trying to attack anyone, OK? Confused

 
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 PostPosted: Fri Oct 07, 2011 6:10 pm 

Thunderbird
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Guys, I don't like gays. My personal opinion. No offense to anyone, just I see the things this way. I'm glad I was able to hear your opinion on this tread, but everything was just on curiosity level. I understand Laura, I get how she thinks, but I cannot accept that as my opinion. I guess that makes us different. Maya, I know you're smarter than me and I know I do and think things, that you don't like and maybe they are not right, but if those are mistakes, then those are the mistakes I decided to do. Please don;t hate me. And it really is a hard topic, because there are so many points of view and experiences - we'll never get to a single-sided solution. But it's great. Having the possibility to discuss it with you is great, because I do not have often the possibility to talk about this stuff with smart people.
So if I offended anyone - I apologize.

And we just played our third game at the tournament and we won 5:1. Time to have some beers Smile Beer Beer Beer

 
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 PostPosted: Fri Oct 07, 2011 10:39 pm 

Heropsychosacha
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+Lakini+ wrote:
Heropsychosacha wrote:
+Lakini+ wrote:
'I know X. Y and Z, they are jerks and they happen to play tennis, ergo a lot of tennis players are probably also jerks.' It's not logical, because it takes exactly one nice tennis player to invalidate your assumption.


So now all tennis players are jerks? Razz

No, seriously, this must be the most stupid discussion we've ever had on WFT. I don't feel any need to contribute.


Sacha, have you read the entire post?

And just for the record, I didn't pick tennis players as an example on purpose. It was the first thing that came to mind, I'm not trying to attack anyone, OK? Confused


Oh god, sorry dear, I was in a silly mood and pretended to be hurt. Laughing Of course I read then entire post, and I agree with you. I don't even know any tennis players Razz

 
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 PostPosted: Fri Oct 07, 2011 10:42 pm 

Heropsychosacha
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...but I still think that this discussion doesn't fit in our normal WFT-level of understanding and being tolerant towards each other.

 
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 PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2011 9:06 am 

LittleBird
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And to continue ontopic,
The curious case of one Hollywood hottie:





 
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 PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2011 10:33 am 

+Lakini+
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OH GOD WHAT AM I LOOKING AT MAKE IT GO AWAY Shocked Shocked

 
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 PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2011 11:10 am 

lynx
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Is this the horrible truth behind veganism Shocked

Razz

 
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 PostPosted: Tue Nov 01, 2011 1:59 am 

LittleBird
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 PostPosted: Tue Nov 01, 2011 5:55 pm 

Thunderbird
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Before it turns to be a completely-ruled-by-girls topic, please let me see your opinion on that combination Cool



 
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 PostPosted: Tue Nov 01, 2011 7:45 pm 

LittleBird
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Now, who is she? Smile

 
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 PostPosted: Tue Nov 01, 2011 8:46 pm 

Thunderbird
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LittleBird wrote:
Now, who is she? Smile


Do you really want me to ask the same question about the guy from the above post? Smile Smile Smile

I guess they share the same history Wink

 
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 PostPosted: Tue Nov 01, 2011 10:15 pm 

LittleBird
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Do they? Laughing
Well the guy above is a Greek guy i met in a chat yesterday, the pic was taken when he was younger though. The recent pics he showed me were nothing, but this one's mmm

 
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 PostPosted: Mon Nov 07, 2011 11:05 pm 

lynx
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C'mon, Bianca! Smile


 
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